People (in general) complaining (rightfully) about crunch are the same people (generally) complaining about bugs, so what I get about this game is that there will be lots of complaints regardless.

You don't develp a game for close to a decade (not sure about this as I haven't been following), in a genre that's barely touched no less, that people have been clamoring for for the longest time, and get out of this alive.

Yes thanks, I shouldn't of. I'd like to blame my utter lack of diplomacy on all the years spent in hostile kitchens but that would be far too ironic, and not actually true.

I'm sorry to of made this a shitty read for people just wanting to chat about cyberpunk reviews.

Sorry non cyberpunk ramble about work here! This is a great and the way it should be. In my career as a chef I've taken on several head chef roles, I am not a fan of that position really I'm not passionate about food at all and I hate having responsibility, the main reason I have taken these jobs is to have control of the rota. So I make it that nobody except myself works more than 8 hours and any shift ending at night has either the next morning off or the next evening off in rotation, depending on the persons preference, which is very unusual. This simple method of not making people work early until late then again in the morning everyday makes such a huge difference to...kinda everything. It's so much more productive and better environment just from something as simple as decent time in between shifts, that arent 12+ hours. Why the catering industry relies on this AFD culture I have no idea (afd is All Fucking Day which is usually 9am-10pm kind of shift). It's wrong and it's wrong in gaming or factories or any other workplace. Where it becomes more complicated is the fact that it has to be completly ok and supported if people want to do those long hours, some people want to pour thier time into work and that really needs to be accepted and appretiated, along side of it being regulated as an option, not a necessity, and I don't think the answer is a blanket nuke the whole thing approach like my new best friend @briarpack seems to think.

Anyway that's enough fuck the system talk from me, back to Cyberpunk...:/

6 hours to go

I'm gonna get it because I know what kinds of games I like, and I know that I will like this game. I wasn't expecting this game to actually have anything meaningful to say, but if I get to live out the fantasy of turning myself into a corporate-killing cyborg, I'm at least gonna have some fun with it.

I mean, yeah. This is a fundamental disagreement. I think tight regulation of overtime is a necessity, shaking crunch culture is hard otherwise.

Ok well I'd like to apologise for saying you don't understand and for being so hostile, I see now that we are both looking at the same thing just from a different angle. That's interesting and I like the positive nature of it. I think maybe you underestimate how many people enjoy and even need that crunch level of pressure though, it's certainly something I want in my day to day work and feel... basically bored without it. The long relentless hours though is an easier issue to talk about and we do seem to agree on that at least.

I hope the inevitable pressure on CDPR with the its buggy initial feedback and their reputation for 'post release support' doesn't become another bad example.

No hard feelings, sorry it got so heated :D

@vikingrk: Did you play The Last of Us 2?

Firmly in wait and see mode. I want to play the new Yakuza first but in general I have a solid tolerance for "open world jank" as Ryan used to say if the experience is worth it aside from the rough edges. Fallout 3 and New Vegas the two most obvious examples. So perhaps wait for a price drop or stabilizing patch

Coming back around to reviews: has anybody mentioned how variable this game experience is? For example, pretty sure it was Rob Zacny who said he spent about 13 hours in the prologue, then mainlined the rest of the game for review in another 11 hours or so...but doubled back to do a bunch of side content before coming back to the climax and realized he had about six new endings to choose from.

Could this game be drawing more from it's roleplay roots than anyone is really talking about due to the myriad bugs, cultural touchstones and general loftiness of expectations around its core storytelling? Just curious if this has been talked about at all or it's less open ended than I interpreted his comments to be.

I've got some bad news for you about a Series X version...

@nodima: If that is the case, I imagine reviewers getting code super late hasn't helped with exposing how robust the RPG mechanics might actually be.

I usually don't care for reviews and head straight for the game that catches my eye. However, I can't ignore criticism towards bugs in the game, so I will wait until they are mostly fixed.

I'm still waiting for my EVGA Stepup to a 3080. So if anything this gives me more of an excuse to wait to get my 3080 then buy. Hopefully by then it'll have some good patches.

Missing option:

I pre-ordered in June 2019 and had zero intention of cancelling.

About an hour into it on base xbox one. Looks and plays great to me!

Still bought it on PS4 even though I had tempered my expectations with all the delays this got. At best, I'll enjoy it for what it is while not beelining through the game in hopes of post-launch support from CDPR. At worst, I'll likely get my third favorite Deus Ex game.

Oops Cyberpunk killed Steam.

@efesell: Nothing I love more than a preloaded game "unlocking" and then needing to download another 10 gigs at 800 kb/s thanks to all the other people trying to download 10 gigs.

The reviews actually made me way more interested than I was. Even the negative ones mention a gigantic amount of sidequests to do and upgrades to earn, which is one of my biggest gaming weaknesses. I also love the idea of being able to create a life/routine in this game completely independent of the main story. Won't be Day 1, but I'll probably pick it up once the bugs are ironed out and the price drops, or when CDPR pulls another miracle on Switch and ports it.

Definitely not giving my money to a company that has repeatedly shown how me and people like me are nothing but a grotesque spectacle to be exploited according to them.

There are just under 850k playing Cyberpunk on Steam right now...

The highest concurrent player count for Witcher 3 was just over 100k which is really high already!

Actually, the number is 875,591 In-Game now

Hyped game is popular on release date. Also, the PS5 is sold out all over the place. Gravity still applies to all matter.

I've played three hours and am really enjoying it so far. It's buggy but nothing that breaks the game so far. It really reminds me of Skyrim/Fallout 4 at launch. Yeah, there's buggy weird stuff but you can still enjoy the game. Some of the criticism re: bugs, even from Jeff G and Jeff B, whom I both like, are flat out hyperbolic. Listening to them you'd think the game is unplayable broken trash. There are games out there that are a LOT more broken. I'm playing on PC with a 3090 so YMMV.

It's like if Deus Ex: Mankind Divided and Fallout 4 were combined into a single game. If that doesn't sound like you'd like it then you probably wouldn't. I guess people are disappointed because this was hyped to be a GrOuDbReAkInG nExT-gEn ExPeRiEnCe? I don't know, it's what I thought it would be and I'm digging it.

This game just seems unfinished. I wasn't expecting much but somehow I'm bummed.

Since platforms for games usually offer discounts only on big holidays, I think it's worth waiting for the new year.

Have seen some footage for console and pc now and yeah... I'm going to stick to waiting. I'll just treat the eventual "enhanced edition" release that comes loaded with patches and additional content as the actual release. I've got too much going on and too many other games to really want to rush into this one. Hope those that do pick it up are able to enjoy it without anything game breaking.

This feels kinda like an Andromeda situation where the expectations are going to come crashing down so I'm just going to wait it out. I'd rather play when it's at its best state than join in on all of the chaos this time.

Honestly, prior to reviews this game seemed a bit lame and "edgy" in a way I found super off-putting... Now that reviews have been like middling to good, I think I'll wait till the Game of the Year edition is like $20 in a year.

Yes, I bought it. I do not trust Gamespot reviews lately (especially from Kallie Plaggie)

I find it interesting how 50 critics have reviewed this game giving it a 91/100 rating on average

48 Positive

2 Mixed

and in comes Gamespot (Kallie Plaggie) to lower the average score for this great game:

Gamespot gives it a 70/100

GamesBeat gives it a 60/100

Nothing much else to say........this data speaks for itself.

@demonsoul: Oh no not the metacritic.

Fiends.

I have not really read any reviews, but damn if the quick look didn't completely convince me to wait, if not just outright skip it. Apart from how exquisitely buggy and poorly-performing it currently appears, it just looks dull. I guess maybe I'm too old for stuff that tries so hard to be edgy, but none of the characters that were shown in the quick look seemed to have any personality beyond a steadfast commitment to swearing. I mean, shit, I love swearing as much as the next person, but it's hardly something that makes a character interesting. Maybe things really change later in the game, but nothing about what I've seen makes me want dive into the world the way the Witcher series did.

How DARE two outlets not echo the same numeric score as everyone else! You go on ahead; I'll get my coat and meet you down at the town square for the burning of the effigies.

@demonsoul: What did you think about opinions levied by Giant Bomb, all of which were available at the same time?

I take a stand once npcs and characters are straight up T-posing and physics are exploding randomly.

If it's buggier than a Bethesda game, it's unacceptable.

That said, nobody I personally know has had ANY major issues... So, this seems kind of overblown.

I'm all for the consumer base taking a stand, and I'm glad people aren't just swallowing whatever is handed to them.. But man, that's a power that needs to be wielded well. This seems like a labor of love that was released too early.

The crunch issues are systemic and maybe tackling the game industry is a good.. first step?

The trans issue I can't speak of, but the game itself isn't even trying to make a statement about gender identity other than "HAH, I can slap a penis on a girl", It's devoid of commentary, so I think that's also overblown. (Unless you want to look into how EVERYTHING in the game is commercialized, but then you're looking at Cyberpunk genre in general)

I pretty much immediately wrote this game off when I saw just how horribly hilarious the cars in this game are. They drive like a horse walks... It feels like the car is just a cardboard thing strapped to your shoulders.. When you turn the car, the car kinda just snaps to the side like you're pressing W and D to diagonally strafe-walk forward in a game... Fucking ridiculous. The cars aren't physically connected to the world at all it seems.. When you turn, both the front and the rear tires seem to be moving.. Like it just spins at a central pivot point.. wtf...

Meh, this game was overhyped because the dev made a good game. First they made one unplayable one that was patched to be playable and almost enjoyable. Then the next game was shit at launch but clearly there was a diamond in there somewhere for a small number of people. Then Witcher 3 was a masterpiece.. I think people expected cyberpunk to follow the trajectory, but this is definitely giving off more of a Witcher 1 vibe than Witcher 3...

Despite its issues, I actually enjoyed TW1. I enjoyed it enough to play it multiple times. The second installment was horse shit. One time through was all I needed to experience. We all know how the third went. I absolutely adore that game and never get tired of playing it. I currently have over 850hrs on it and always seem to find something I've never seen before. I always find something new and interesting in each time. I just wish it was possible for Ciri to join the Lodge as an ending. CDPR dropped the ball on that one. I have never and will never go for the terrible ending.

The vehicles in Cyberpunk are awful. They handle like a forklift on ice. Roach's handling is better. The combat is also bland and doesn't bring anything groundbreaking to the genre. It really seems like CDPR spent 8 years copying ideas from other games we've all played in the past. It's really nothing but a cyberpunk Fallout with some elements of GTA V. There's nothing innovating about it.

Yes, why?

Does that really make or break a great game though? Nothing all that innovative about Ghost of Tsushima, but I love it. Everything is just very solid and the experience holds together well. But from a technical/mechanical standpoint, it's a very traditional open world stealth/action game, easily confused for an Assassins Creed at first glance.

I really feel like as games diversify more and more it's going to be the subtlety's that stand out, not these huge 'innovative experiences' that many gamers grew up with. It's just getting harder and harder to make something 'new' that's also cohesive. Except for VR, can't wait to see what thatll be like in 10+ years.

I wouldn't single out the gamespot review. 7/10 implies something broadly positive. And the numbers themselves mean nothing without context. On the face of it, Cyberpunk has been very well received critically.

Actually reading Gamesbeat's summary doesn't do me any favours.

I think that Cyberpunk 2077 delivers the big-budget gaming thrills that many people are looking for. But it falls short in a few key areas for me, and a lot of that comes as a byproduct of its ambition.

Okay, that's broad and non-committed. I've read the review now and they seem to echo the idea that nothing new has been brought to the table. For that to be worth a six, this thrill-ride rollercoaster they're talking about must've bored them.

A lot of the game is just there to look good. And that’s fine — but it means I don’t want to spend a lot of time wandering around the world. If the environment primarily exists to look dope in the background while I’m doing the quests, then I’ll probably mostly stick to the main story, see what happens, and then bounce.

Oh. That's exactly what's happened. Reviews are weird things to write, guys.

As for me, I'll wait for a sale price to bite, if at all. I feel like the cyberpunk aesthetic hasn't moved on since the Blade Runner / Neuromancer template. It kind of bores me too unless they're trying to add something to it. I wasn't really hyped for it to begin with. Witcher sprawls and has a rich fiction ready to draw upon. This is CDPR from scratch and I'm not sure it's going to hit like their other work.

I wasn't expecting the world to change with this release so I'm pretty satisfied overall playing on a base console. Could it be smoother and be bug free? Sure, but it's packing quite a bit with all the content. Could it look better? Sure, but I'm playing on an old ass machine.

@vikingrk: If you wanna condemn CDPR for bad work environment you need to do the same for ND.

@jepsen1977: This, isn't a thread about TLOU 2?

I don't regret buying the game or pre-ordering it, but does anyone else just find the game...NOT fun?

I am going to finish it but I have ZERO drive past the main story. You don't have to engage with ANY of the systems, the dialogue isn't great...the game really does feel like a mess.

I am gonna play it at some point because that kinda game (even in a buggy mess) is my jam... but I have also been on this CDPR ride enough times to know your better off waiting for patches. (also pretty sure my 380x wouldn't run it even at 30fps)

@mackdack: It has mostly been running fine for me on my Xbox one x but....yeah, I find all of the voice acting bad to grating at best and I'm largely just not enjoying the playing of it? Like the moment to moment action is just not fun to me?

@sethmode: that’s the part that has me bummed out big time. It’s just not fun for me.

I’m going to start to mainline and see if something clicks. I must be mid act 2 now so I doubt much will drop in act 3 that will blow my mind.

I was always going to hold off until I got a PS5, but now I’m not even sure I’ll buy it then.

Ghost of Tsushima is fun. Cyberpunk 2077 isn't. There's no way in hell I'm going to subject myself to another play through of this game, once I'm finished with the main story. Once the deed is done, it's being uninstalled and forgotten about.

It'll be interesting to read and watch videos about the trials and tribulations that led up to this shitty game. I bet mismanagement had an awful lot to do with it. The burnout by the employees likely played a part as well. We will have to see in the coming months.

I dunno, it's not reinventing the open world or anything. But I think it's a really neat world to be in and I'm having a ton of fun playing it. It certainly helps that I've not been hit with any bugs, and probably helps more that I really largely stayed off of the hype train beyond just being generally excited for CDPR making something.

It's a good game, I wish it functioned better for more people than it does.

@vikingrk: I didn’t mean to necessarily imply that nobody in the games industry cares about the otherwise marginalized people and issues. I’d even bet that a few of those caring people DO come from those bad companies but sometimes a job has to be more important than any moral objections. Especially now, that said outside of indie devs it’s really hard to find a developer or publisher who hasn’t done something either morally questionable or downright terrible.

Like I said I can definitely acknowledge CDPR has some work to do (if they care to) to address what they have done wrong. Maybe it makes me a slightly worse person to still want to play the game, but I choose to believe that not everyone at CDPR deserves to be punished for what is likely the decisions of a handful of ignorant people.

Well, a few things here. First, like I said before, we're all hypocrites. I'm not going to say that buying TLOU2 was the right thing to do just because I chose to do it. If I were my perfect self, I most likely would not have bought TLOU2.

Also, like @sethmode said, this thread is about CP2077/CDPR. While I do think a large conversation is worth having about labour practises in the industry in general, I don't think we HAVE to talk about what happens at ND to talk about what happens at CDPR. This thread is focused on the latter.

Are they being punished though? There are plenty of games I don't buy. Am I punishing the people who worked on Dirt 5 if I don't buy it because I don't like racing games?