If you were a fan of Tom Clancy's tactical shooters in the past (Rogue Spear, Ghost Recon/Island Thunder, Splinter Cell 1 through Chaos Theory) then this game just shits all over that love and loyalty. I mean we all knew the demise of Tom Clancy was coming when Rainbow Six: Lockdown was released, and the realization probably full set in with Splinter Cell: Conviction, but now it's confirmed with Ghost Recon: Future Soldier. It's not Tom Clancy anymore. There are no tactical or strategic elements in this game, it's full of on-rails sequences where you're completely unable to determine the outcome of events save for where to aim your trigger, and all logic and realism are fully scrubbed in favor of cinematic blunder and Call of Duty thrills.

It's good if you didn't grow up on tactical, realistic, patience-rewarding Tom Clancy titles but it's going to be like tiny papers cuts all over your gums if Rainbow Six Rogue Spear was your favorite game in the series. Stay away from it, Tom Clancy lovers. The TC franchise is dead, but not only that, they're raping it while it's down.

There is zero planning, zero squad command, linear levels, on-rails cinematic shooting, and fast-paced unrealistic shooting. Buy it for the coop and take it back right when you're done, otherwise, stay away. I mean if you thought Ghost Recon 2 strayed too far from the series' roots, then you'll just "love" this entry into the series, lol.

I really wish they made another game like the original Ghost Recon :(

From MW3 to this...

@FancySoapsMan said:

I really wish they made another game like the original Ghost Recon :(

I haven't played more than a few minutes of the first Ghost Recon but just in general, wouldn't (the recently Kickstarter'd) Takedown be up your alley in theory (although that might be more like Rainbow Six)?

games have changed dude.

I've been a huge fan of Tom Clancy since the start, and I competed in MLG Toronto for Rainbow Six Vegas 2.

This game is streamlined in the best way possible and it's awesome. I disagree to the fullest extent of my ability.

Oh, I had forgotten how much I loved Rainbow Six: Rogue Spear until you mentioned it in your post. Not interested in playing it by myself anymore tho.

Would be cool to see dudes play it at Random PC Game or something...

Tom Clancy is literally not involved at any point in production now, he sold his name.

@GS_Dan said:

Tom Clancy is literally not involved at any point in production now, he sold his name.

:(

Tom Clancy Ghost Recon 3ds was a good tactical game, but if your looking for a tactical shooter then those are long since dead. Hopefully Rainbow 6 patriots will be what your looking for.

It might not fall into slow-paced and planning for 10 mins territory but It does what it does well. I've always prefered co-op with buddies anyway.

I loved the campaign, beat it in two days renting it from redbox. Downloading the full game from psn now so I can play coop and stuff with friends.

games have changed dude.

@Rohok: yep, couch co-op is all that this game is good for... and I don't need another multiplayer to distract me.

I'm just disappointed beyond belief. Even GRAW 2 was pretty tactical, allowing for neat squad control similar to Brothers in Arms and some sweet fire support options like tanks and helicopters and air strikes from mission to mission.

Seriously you expected this to be tactical. Nothing they have shown from this game has come up close to tactical, i don't understand if it comes as a surprise to anyone.

How tactical was GRAW? I havnt played Ghost Recon since the first so I wouldnt know, but I thought Ghost Recon stopped being tactical at like 2.

@Rawrz said:

How tactical was GRAW? I havnt played Ghost Recon since the first so I wouldnt know, but I thought Ghost Recon stopped being tactical at like 2.

I can't say anything of the console versions of the GRAW games since I never played those versions, but the PC versions of GRAW 1 and 2 were tactical shooters.

@FancySoapsMan said:

I really wish they made another game like the original Ghost Recon :(

Or rather ... like the original Rainbow Six (Rogue Spear). You know, with actual planning etc.

@xaLieNxGrEyx said:

I've been a huge fan of Tom Clancy since the start, and I competed in MLG Toronto for Rainbow Six Vegas 2.

This game is streamlined in the best way possible and it's awesome. I disagree to the fullest extent of my ability.

I was a huge fan of rainbow six vegas 2 multiplayer and was wondering if this is something you would recommend?

@Rawrz said:

How tactical was GRAW? I havnt played Ghost Recon since the first so I wouldnt know, but I thought Ghost Recon stopped being tactical at like 2.

I can't say anything of the console versions of the GRAW games since I never played those versions, but the PC versions of GRAW 1 and 2 were tactical shooters.

They never will bring back the old formulas. It's obviously not what sells, as people seem to like this streamlined, simplified garbage for whatever reason, lol.

I've played almost every Ghost Recon (I think one of the previous generation games), and the new one is one of my favourite GR games that theyve produced.

Edit - guess I should clarify. After 10 years of playing ghost recon games where you lie in a field in 10 minutes planning, aligning the team and waiting for the perfect moment, I'm a bit sick of it. Which is why I love future soldier so much - I only have to plan for a minute or two at the most, and I still get the same kind of satisfaction out of it when the plan goes off perfectly.

@TEHMAXXORZ said:

From MW3 to this...

Treyarch does actually put out decent shooters and Black Ops 2 looks damn cool. Ghost Recon looks about about as thrilling as waiting on line at the DMV.

@Artigkar said:

@Rawrz said:

How tactical was GRAW? I havnt played Ghost Recon since the first so I wouldnt know, but I thought Ghost Recon stopped being tactical at like 2.

I can't say anything of the console versions of the GRAW games since I never played those versions, but the PC versions of GRAW 1 and 2 were tactical shooters.

ARE THEY EVER! I've been playing GRAW 1 recently, and while the friendly AI and various bugs have been making that a rather miserable experience, I can report that it is actually an enjoyable tactical game. There is a map, and a complex orders system...and you actually have to use it.

Granted, I already had a love of that game from my youth, so I'm slightly biased.

I can also confirm that console games require some pretty serious planning also.

Mmm, no. I love the originals, and I love the newer ones as well. Well, I haven't played this, but I'm just saying, I like them all pretty much the same. I can pick a few here and there that I didn't really care for, like Double Agent, Vegas 2, and... yeah.

why is it that if a game is different in a way that is less than ideal, so many people jump to saying things like "_______ is dead, and they are raping its corpse!"? its a tad bit extreme, don't you think? and really sexually aggressive. and its not even an apt metaphor. the Tom Clancy franchise isn't a non-consenting participant. the Tom Clancy franchise isn't even a sentient thing. it doesn't represent a group of people either, its just a collection of intellectual property trademarks. and the trademarks are being used to create financially successful pieces of merchandise. now if we pretended that a group of intellectual property trademarks were in fact sentient, wouldn't the one thing that might satisfy them in some kind of sexual manner be being used to create successful products? i think so. also, using rape metaphors for bullshit things like games you don't like is seriously offensive to rape survivors.
 
also, chill dude. go re-install rouge spear if thats the game you wanna keep playing forever. maybe download a single player mod or something. did it have mods? whatever.

Damn. I was kinda interested in this :(

@jerseyscum said:

@TEHMAXXORZ said:

From MW3 to this...

Treyarch does actually put out decent shooters and Black Ops 2 looks damn cool. Ghost Recon looks about about as thrilling as waiting on line at the DMV.

I've only played the campaign, but it was pretty thrilling. Awesome awesome awesome prison extraction level.

@Rohok said:

They never will bring back the old formulas. It's obviously not what sells, as people seem to like this streamlined, simplified garbage for whatever reason, lol.

Yeah, well, you know.. That's just, like, your opinion, man.

Dammit, I was so excited for a non Call of Duty FPS, but alas, my dreams are crushed once again.

@Rohok said:

It's good if you didn't grow up on tactical, realistic, patience-rewarding Tom Clancy titles but it's going to be like tiny papers cuts all over your gums if Rainbow Six Rogue Spear was your favorite game in the series.

Buy it for the coop and take it back right when you're done, otherwise, stay away.

Make up your mind.

I don't have the time and the patience to play games like the original ghost recon anymore....sad thing is the original ghost recon on PC is one of my favorite games ever, nothing like taking over red square or assaulting that farm in the middle of the night....but that was a different time.

I think Rainbow Six 3 on PC was the last tactical shooter I really enjoyed. It was good about being challenging without being too frustrating. It's too bad they'll probably never make another Rainbow Six game like that. I guess the gamepad wouldn't work very well on the tactical map and, more importantly, people seem to buy games that are like Call of Duty. Not that there is anything wrong with Call of Duty games, they are a goofy good time, but I'd like a game that was a nice middle ground between CoD and ARMA.

@Rohok said:

If you were a fan of Tom Clancy's tactical shooters in the past (Rogue Spear, Ghost Recon/Island Thunder, Splinter Cell 1 through Chaos Theory) then this game just shits all over that love and loyalty. I mean we all knew the demise of Tom Clancy was coming when Rainbow Six: Lockdown was released, and the realization probably full set in with Splinter Cell: Conviction, but now it's confirmed with Ghost Recon: Future Soldier. It's not Tom Clancy anymore. There are no tactical or strategic elements in this game, it's full of on-rails sequences where you're completely unable to determine the outcome of events save for where to aim your trigger, and all logic and realism are fully scrubbed in favor of cinematic blunder and Call of Duty thrills.

It's good if you didn't grow up on tactical, realistic, patience-rewarding Tom Clancy titles but it's going to be like tiny papers cuts all over your gums if Rainbow Six Rogue Spear was your favorite game in the series. Stay away from it, Tom Clancy lovers. The TC franchise is dead, but not only that, they're raping it while it's down.

There is zero planning, zero squad command, linear levels, on-rails cinematic shooting, and fast-paced unrealistic shooting. Buy it for the coop and take it back right when you're done, otherwise, stay away. I mean if you thought Ghost Recon 2 strayed too far from the series' roots, then you'll just "love" this entry into the series, lol.

Spot on.

I truly despise Ubisoft. I've gone on about the downfall of Tom Clancy games for what seems like an eternity, but I can't help but feel obligated to comment when Ubisoft releases yet another dumbed-down, casual friendly title. It's funny to see seen certain reviews claim that GR:FS stays true to its roots. Sure it does. Gamers are hit over the head with over-the-top, Hollywood-esque shooters every year so the moment a game comes out that is slightly less arcade oriented than what they're use to, they think it's tactical and realistic. These are the type of people who aren't familiar with Tom Clancy games of old. Hell, I've seen people (from multiple websites) claim that this game feels like Gears of War or Army of TWO! Whaaaa-? Thankfully, games like ARMA are still being created and Project Takedown is the works thanks to Kickstarter. I can always boot up Rogue Spear/Raven Shield and SWAT 4, so not all is doom and gloom.

EUROGAMER pretty much summed it up.

Like it or not, Modern Warfare exerts a powerful gravitational pull on the games within its orbit - and, while the titles under the Tom Clancy brand may have started out as tactical simulations, they're not immune to the inexorable tug of Activision's super-dense star.

A couple of handheld spin-offs aside, the last time Ghost Recon saw the light of day was in 2007's Advanced Warfighter 2, and much has changed since then. All three Modern Warfare games have raised the blockbuster stakes where military bombast is concerned, while two Gears of War sequels have solidified and defined the template for third-person cover-based shooters. The fact Future Soldier takes more than a few cues from these commercial juggernauts is as inevitable as it is disappointing.

@Dagbiker said:

Hopefully Rainbow 6 patriots will be what your looking for.

pffthahaha

...sorry bout that

I bought the last rainbow 6 game and it was awful, I really like the console versions of GRAW 1 and 2 and i enjoyed conviction for what it was, really liked its coop, sucks that this has none of the squad command stuff, that was always the most interesting part, i loved making my team do all the work once i finished the game playing normally, trying to clear levels with just the 3 teammates was fun

@Rohok said:

It's good if you didn't grow up on tactical, realistic, patience-rewarding Tom Clancy titles but it's going to be like tiny papers cuts all over your gums if Rainbow Six Rogue Spear was your favorite game in the series.

Buy it for the coop and take it back right when you're done, otherwise, stay away.

Make up your mind.

I don't have the time and the patience to play games like the original ghost recon anymore....sad thing is the original ghost recon on PC is one of my favorite games ever, nothing like taking over red square or assaulting that farm in the middle of the night....but that was a different time.

How much would I like this game if I loved Splinter Cell: Conviction?

@Rohok: Great post. This was exactly the type of opinion I wanted on the game.

As a side note, how did you feel about GR: Raven Shield 3? Personally, it and SWAT 4 are my favorite tactical shooters.

I'm digging it.

There needs to be a game like Arma, but with good controls.

@DeathbyYeti said:

@Dagbiker said:

Hopefully Rainbow 6 patriots will be what your looking for.

pffthahaha

...sorry bout that

The little bit of gameplay shown of Patriots actually looked relatively tactical. The player seems to have very precise control over how their gun is positioned in cover. In no way am I suggesting that I expect it to be good, but I have some (blind) hopes.

Edit: Went back and watched the video. Turns out, it isn't gameplay. But assuming that it's roughly representative, it looks more tactical than GRFS.

The original Ghost Recon games were hardly tactical. They were punishing, unforgiving, and required you to be methodical. But tactical? No, you're clouded by nostalgia. Ultimately, all it boiled down to was to never let your Ghosts get shot at while taking out enemies one by one. Same for a lot of other games at the time as well.

The first Brothers in Arms did tactics way better. Scouting an area to figure out where best to put a fireteam, locating the best possible flanking routes were located for your assault team, hell Gearbox had that Army Colonel appear in every one of their promotional videos to tell you about the 4 F's. Find, Fire, Flank, Finish the job.

Never played it, but I heard a lot of good things about Full Spectrum Warrior. Remember reading some news articles that it was used to help treat PTSD. The Army seemed to like it so much that they didn't mind spending millions of dollars on it. Granted, they've wasted far more money on far more useless, unnecessary things. Like the Commanche or the Crusader programs.

GRAW introduced some squad and other various support mechanics into the series. The AI wasn't always the best, but they generally knew what to do once the red diamonds appeared on the HUD. I always thought the Network stuff was pretty cool, i.e. being able to see live video feeds from cameras on the helmets of other Ghosts, on UAV's, tanks, etc. Added greatly to a lot of the tactical elements to the game. Both games were short and fairly linear, but overall not bad games.

From what I've seen of Future Soldier, it seems to take the Ghost Recon down to a new level of crappy, linear stealth sections. That's not what I want out of any FPS/TPS. Do you even get to control your squad besides marking targets? I can only imagine Tom Clancy games getting worse from hear on out.

@Rohok

I see you're on the Project Takedown forums, nice.

I'm enjoying the single player and co-op. the online has been a blast. I've seen people play pretty tactically with the sabotage game mode. I would agree its not as close to the old games, but still enjoyable none the less. I'm glad with my purchase,

Really dissapointed with what they did to the multiplayer. I was a big fan of GRAW 1 and 2 but this game is so much more fast paced and action heavy. That along with the close corridors maps are not a good change to me.

I love how everyone throws around the word "tactical."

Running in a straight line spraying your gun everywhere is a tactic, believe it or not. So instead of saying it's not tactical anymore, explain specifically why it's not as good.

I might try out the free to play online game before I make a decision on buying the full game or not. I loved the hell out of Rainbow Six: Vegas 1 & 2.

I never really dug the older Rainbow 6 games, just the idea of planning out this gameplan, making your way in the slowest way, only to get done up by some dude, you didn't see out the corner of your eyes and you have to do ALL THAT AGAIN!

But I really enjoyed R6: Vegas 2, it still had you pace out your attack, but you could take a bit more damage and the game didn't penalize you for saying eff it and just murdering everything.

From what I've seen from Future Solider, it's a mix, but not true to what fans want. You can pace our moe of attack, and toss out sensors and pick guys off one by one, but then you'll moments where you are being swarmed and it turns into something you'd see out of more modern military games. But, I think it looks fun, and would be fun to play with friends online, but yeah if you love the more challenging games, this might not be the one for you.

In my day, I was feared because I was a decent sniper in R6: Perfect Sword, and I liked it

I miss the first ghost recon game, that was really really fun.