What Will Sony's Response Be?

@zeik: Oh for sure, it’s always been the case. Which is why I really don’t get the complaining from people about the Series S’s shortcomings. If it’s not a console that works for someone’s needs, then get a Series X instead. If it’s too expensive, wait the year or so before the first price drop like any other generation.

I really didn't believe they would have an option less than $499 but that's when I thought Series X was going to be $599. Given the recent revelations I'm gonna say we get $499/$399 (for the digital one).

I got a feeling that Sony is going to bite the bullet and sell their consoles at $399 and $299 to undercut Microsoft.

Every rumor about the PS5 has indicated it's gonna be more expensive. I believe Sony is going to try to be the "premium" console experience, coming off the success of the PS4, just as they did with the PS3 (but with better marketing). I could be wrong, but I just can't see them sucking the number of eggs required to match (let alone beat) Microsoft's pricing.

EDIT: But I could see them matching Microsoft with the diskless version. In fact, they kinda have to.

Well I am going diskless. I haven’t bought a physical game in 3 or 4 years.

@tebbit: Narrator: "They didn't."

I initially thought I'd get diskless because I don't buy games, but I also use my console as a blu ray player and 100 isn't enough to give that up/add more things to plug into my TV.

Happy to eat my hat. The $399 PlayStation 5 is going to be really hard to turn down, provided you have a stable enough internet plan and no severe data caps.

Is the only difference between the two the disk drive, or is there spec differences as well?

Just as expected. $560 dollarydoos for Demon's Souls 2.0.

I'll think about it. I've still got a pretty huge PS4, Switch and PC backlog, though.

Just the drive.

@facelessvixen: Demon's Souls is also on PC apparently.

With all these first-party exclusives coming to PS4, that just verifies that even Sony cross-gen will just be this gen's graphics with some added ray tracing and at higher resolutions and framerates. Not that that's a bad thing, but it also means that I'm probably fine sticking with my PS4 and RTX 2070 for a few more years. And we'll probably only see a handful of games that will make use of PS5's unique SSD implementation that isn't just faster loading times.

And those games will be almost all $70 across the board. The price of next- I mean cross-gen.

@inevpatoria: Thanks. Think that means I'll get a Series X at launch, or close to it, and then a digital PS5 once enough games come out for it.

If God of War is really next year I'll get a PS5 for that. I still don't see a reason why I'd get a PS5 or Xbox in 2020.

Miles Morales is on PS4 as well so that major get is going to be more of the same. QTE events galore whoopty do.

Their ps plus service has games that you can get used at GameStop for like $100 for all of them. There were no enhancements announced and I think it’s hilarious they showed second son. That game is ps2 quality gameplay.

Digital gives you the privilege of paying full price and the shenanigans of ultimate edition getting unlocked 24 or 48 hours earlier.

I wonder if the list of PlayStation Plus titles that are going to available at launch gives us a window into what may be getting announced/launched for PS5? A game like Fallout 4 for example, could this be a way of getting people to be interested in a Fallout 76 PS5 Edition or a Fallout 5? Seems like the games listed, especially from the first party side, have sequels announced (Ratchet and Clank for instance) and I would assume The Last of Us Part 2 gets a PS5 edition at some stage (not for free I am guessing unless things do not go so great for Sony sales wise, then they may do an upgrade path for free to encourage PS5 sales).

The pricing is interesting at any rate, I am curious how the PS5 diskless system will fare against the Xbox Series S. One seems to be cut back in other ways than just the disk drive, but I am unclear on if this is the same for the PS5 No Disk Drive edition?

The pricing seems fair but I agree with people that there doesnt seem to be much in terms of exclusives around launch, that's generally the case though. (what did we have last gen? KZ:SF & Knack?)

The way I read the PS+ collection when watching the trailer is that you would get all previous PS+ games but it could just be the selection they showed, if so that's pretty weak. (good/great games but I played them all years ago)

@boozak: if they gave you the PS3 titles and somehow the Vita and PS4 titles that would be massive. But since they aren’t in second place like Microsoft (3rd place) the possible is unpossible [sic]. There was no mention of free tier multiplayer so ps plus still required? They might pull some bull on even fortnite or soon to be free rocket league might require ps plus now. Will psplus even offer PS5 games? These events are oftentimes about was is not said.

For those keeping track, it looks like the PS5 has 2 USB 3.x, ethernet, HDMI, and power in back. No optical audio that I could see.

@frytup: The full specs are at the bottom of this article. The article is kind of annoying and I can’t find just a plain product sheet yet.

Article: https://www.theverge.com/2020/9/16/21438782/sony-ps5-size-specs-dimensions-console-huge-large-big

@ll_exile_ll said:

If we're talkin' Demon's Souls remake on PC: Some sites are saying that "Also available on PC" was apparently a whoopsie, so I'm not going to hold my breath on that.

If we're talking Demon's Souls original on PC: I know that RPCS3 is a thing.

@johnlocke: I think it's more of an incentive the other way around. Basically "if you didn't buy a PS4 here's a bunch of the best games that you missed out on, so you'll buy a PS5 and start subscribing to PS Plus". It's a much easier/better sell than a bunch of fresh launch titles.

Apparently, they're going to charge $70 for Demon's Souls. Seems pretty indicative of what Sony will be charging for their first party "blockbuster games".

Def gonna try and snag a disk version as soon as I can. I'm not gonna bother with preorders or launch cause I've known too many horror stories of how that usually goes for a hyped console release. But I'm pretty stoked and the extra price of the disk drive will be made up easily and I get to put my old base ps4 to rest finally.

@brian_: People that embrace digital had better prepare their wallets. Of the 200+ titles I have on Xbox One from this generation I only paid for (according to my spreadsheet) full price at $60 for 17 games about the other 175 games i got through free games with gold (and no i dont consider xbox one titles from gold as part of that list), from Gamestop for pretty cheap, or as a digital sale at around 50% off or better. It's going to be a pretty tough sell for me to digital only on PS5 and since this might be the first console since the (not counting the ps4 lol) since the Dreamcast to not offer disc based backwards compatibility I doubt i will be touching a PS5 this generation. Microsoft needs duplicate the meme from the PS4 launch about handing over a disc right back at Sony.

The PSPlus Collection looks as plain to me now as it did when each of those games launched.

@fourthline: The PS4 commonly had very steep discounts on digital games. Playstation kinda became my personal Steam in the sense that I picked up quite a few games I might not have otherwise just because they were so cheap.

I don't know if I want to pick up a digital only console, as I like the option to buy physical, but last gen I found it was a lot more common to save money buying digital than physical.

@vaiz: brb finding hat to eat.

I would like to hope Sony continues their numerous digital sales over to the PS5, but I'm going to hold off on picking one up until I see that they actually do. $70 isn't a price I'm willing to pay for a video game. Not even for Demon's Souls, which I regard as a top 5 best video game ever.

@zeik: The sales were only to compete with gamestop and be just handing you a game i'm done with. Those sales are going to be about as prevalent going forward as a Friday night showing of the latest blockbuster at a movie theatre, always full price.

I am curious if they're going to create artificial scarcity for the disc based version. I'm surprised they didnt price them the same and just offer up digital licenses for "free" on the digital version. They may be a little scared of the Series-S

@fourthline: I find that reasoning very shaky. Games don’t compete by storefront, they compete with other games. Older games have to lower price to sell because there’s always a new game at full price to compete with.

Even looking at the history of Steam is instructive. That storefront had what was essentially a monopoly on PC games basically from the mid 2000s until very recently. Even without a physical competitor, prices went down at an unprecedented rate. I see no reason why it wouldn’t be the same on PS5 or Xbox.

@fourthline: It also happened with digital only games, so I don't believe that logic.

It's anyone's guess what will happen in the future, but I see no reason to believe with what we know right now that things are going to change drastically.

In theory: Yes, Sony could refuse to have sales on their digital storefront. But that is highly unlikely

For starters, Sony already sell digital cards through many retailers and are unlikely to stop doing so. Hell, after the psp go debacle one might even suspect that they'll crank those up to continue to justify shelf space at said retailers. And as long as those retailers are able to sell the cards they can have their own discounts as amazon tends to do

Now, I know what some of you are thinking: Nintendo, bitch. And you are right. Nintendo locks things down and famously go to war with Amazon every few years over amazon discounting a mario. But Nintendo is Nintendo and their management structure is very different in many ways that are not worth going into right now.

Because, most importantly, Sony kind of have figured out how to be a modern-ish tech company. No, I am not talking about what they let Naughty Dog do (its funny because its worker abuse...) but because they understand they are fighting for time. Sure Sony could insist that Infamous Second Son never dipped below 60 bucks and they could pat themselves on the back that five years later one person REALLY wanted to play that game enough to buy a copy (it was just to launder some cash). But they aren't idiots and they understand that folk will just buy other games instead. And if those other games are noticeably cheaper on other platforms they will trade in their console and go there instead.

And in that regard, the existing model that steam takes to some extremes is the way to go. Launch at 60 (now 70) bucks and get those buyers. Then discount it in a month or three to 50/60 and get the "patient" gamers who will pat themselves on the back for beating the system. Next holiday/major sale go for 30/40 and finally bargain bin it once it reaches end of life. You more or less get everyone at their maximum price AND get a shit ton of people who buy it because they are "collectors"

So yeah. In theory sony could dick everyone over. And then everyone would go buy an xse*.

My policy, in general, is to not trust a company to do anything ever.

@navster15: there was an article yesterday about how the collective total cost for everything on steam is $360,000. The graphic showed a substantial dip during their bi-annual steam sales. Other than that the price keeps climbing and it’s not because the prices are trending downwards. PC players have the most disposable money and are likely to not be as price sensitive as the demographic that plays consoles. How many kids iPhones have Apple Pay or anything permanent on their phones. PlayStations are going to be the same. Some parent is going to shell out $50 for a digital miles morales after they get the thing home. Don’t think so. Sales are made in store when the protection plans and upsales and warranties make them feel like their investment is worth it. Digital never feels like a fair trade.

@gundato: Sony no longer sales their digital games through third party. Only the currency cards. Everybody aspires to be Apple and their ecosystem. Nintendo is kind of the original Apple on their whole draconian policies. Sony would love to lock things down 100%. Btw videogames circa 2020 is all about what’s popping in twitch. What do think the corporate “friend” prices will be for fall guys once it leaves Psplus? $29.99 probably. Of course the foolish logic is get Psplus now. So far we don’t know if that game will even play on PS5. When you place your preorders tomorrow do recognize the caveat to all the questions that we legitimately need answers to like Backward compatibility, controller cost, ps plus PS5 titles, and if fortnite and other free to play games will continue to remain free to play. Probably isnt good enough reason to put coin down.

@fourthline: I believe you are referring to this article:

https://kotaku.com/it-would-cost-538-000-to-buy-everything-on-steam-1845044276

In which case I have no idea what point you are trying to make. Of course the overall total price of games on Steam will go up over time. That’s because there are always more games being added to the store, at an exponential pace that outpaces the price drop of any individual game. Any cursory review of the data presented would not result in a claim that prices for individual PC games are on the rise.

@navster15: Games at GameStop prices for that same time period would probably be a horizontal line if not going down over that same time period. In physical world my Madden 2015 copy goes down to $1.00. In all digital world Madden 2015 ceases to exist therefore price increase over time. As the graph shows.

@fourthline: Digital sales are a thing to increase market potential, and that's not gonna change. Basically you start selling your game at $60, once it's sold about as much as it can at that price you start putting it on sales for $40 to capture a new audience there, and once that audience is dry you start putting it on sales at $20.

It's not about competition in any way, it's about maximizing profits. It's basically the opposite of deluxe editions (going downwards instead of up).

Yeah half the games are $90CAD. That stings

@fourthline: I stand corrected on the note of sony selling digital codes. Weird

But that still doesn't change that they are competing with time and against similar games being sold on their own platforms and that having regular discounts works remarkably well on every platform including their own

@gundato: look at the crap Nintendo is pulling on their limited digital edition 3D Mario collection. If you think that thing is going to have a digital sale on anything other than the possibility some random date is Mario’s birthday or some inanity and now it’s priced at $35 for 35 minutes on March 5th then you haven’t been around long enough. Let the shenanigans begin. I really hate the fact that I’m going to get the Series-S but I’ve pared down the fact I only care about PUBG and I like the fact that if I have people over I have the controllers to support a 4 play split screen game right now. I’m thankful for my digital collection and I only got here because of these corporations duking it out over me. Now people new to gaming. People with a PS4 for their first console or that got the Xbox SAD. I feel horrible about their video game future. One that I ushered in.

I do wonder if used retailers, like Gamestop, will bump up the prices of used games too. Unless I'm not accounting for something, there's not really any reason to bump a used version of the latest release from their typical price of $55 to $65, other than "Hey we want ten more dollars too". I guess they could blame it on a scarcity of physical media with more people being inclined to go digital and the existence of an all digital console. If I were Mr. Gamestop, I'd get out in front of this and say "Yo. We're still going to charge the same prices we've always charge for used games. So yeah, the physical version cost a $100 more, but you'll probably be able to pick up a used game around launch for $15 less".

Yep, that whole sequence about broke my heart. When the chat was going on about Demon Souls on pc, it really for a moment changed how I was going to deal with the fact Demon Souls was about the only game that really appealed to me for the PS5.

But I also knew it was too good to be true.

Now I am debating whether a blue-ray is worth it, or I could interior/exterior attach it to my pc. I have a case with a bay or 2 for dvd or blue-ray, an old Cooler Master Scout 2. But in the future the next case may not...

But Bluepoint's re-make is really looking good.

@fourthline: Oh god. Nintendo. How could I have possibly forgotten about them. Why oh why did I never possibly imagine someone responding "nintendo, bitch" as an argument for why Sony are going to completely change course and ignore what they and all their competitors have been doing

If you want to have a conversation it helps to listen to and respond to people. Otherwise you are just masturbating

@gundato: when I know I’m right and I’m just reading through a PowerPoint that is clearly copy and pasta a couple words in I tend to skip stuff. And not knowing about the PS4 3rd party sales is pretty clear that you aren’t up to date on your hobby. What else don’t you know. Please continue to chime in. Tell me more... the no longer selling digital through 3rd party means they are tieing up lose ends and scrounging for all their little pennies where they can. Do you we need the beastcast to spell out what EACH piece of news actually means? Sony is trying to lock things down in the same fashion. Xbox is just trying to keep a foothold in a market and unlike phones they aren’t willing to quit or go quietly (though they still linger with their surface duo announcement). So Xbox users benefit. Keep up if you’re going to speak up. I come to the bombcast for discussions on food too.