What are some of your personal "benchmark" games you can't help but compare others in the genre against?

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bigsocrates

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I've been dipping back into the Mafia remake that was released in 2020 just because I never finished it and I wanted something story driven and relaxing to play. A lot of people didn't like it but I think it's a perfectly serviceable story game, with some really nice aesthetics and music. Sure the driving and shooting aren't the best, and there are a lot of kind of boring sequences where you're just walking around or driving through the city to some destination (the open world has basically nothing to do in it) but some of the shootouts can be tense and satisfying (others are frustrating) and the cut scenes and performances are above average. It's a perfect example of the problem that not enough people want a "fine" single player experience to justify the cost of production. There's just too much out there to play, and paying full price or close for a solid 7.5 action adventure game seems like a tough ask.

But while I was playing and enjoying Mafia I couldn't help but think of another game. L.A. Noire. The two games have somewhat similar themes of crime in California towards the middle of the 20th century (though Mafia is based in San Francisco during the depression and L.A. Noire is in...L.A. and is a post-war game) and both feature somewhat empty cities where you drive around and listen to old timey radio and talk to your companions. Other than that they're very different, with Mafia being a driving and shooting game and L.A. Noire being about investigations. But L.A. Noire left such a strong impression that it's impossible to play any game in that time period and not think of it. It's a singular, fantastic, game that there's nothing really like almost 15 years later. The dialog system, the intricacy of the environments, the way it blended so many elements from adventure game sleuthing to fistfights.

It was so expensive and delayed that despite being a hit it closed down the studio that made it, but it still left an indelible impression, and remains meme fodder all these years later.

There are other benchmark games for me too. I can't play an open world arcade driving game without thinking of Forza Horizon. That series just defines the genre for me and everything else operates in its shadows. Like a lot of people I compare every superhero game to the Arkham series. Every 3D platformer reminds me to some degree of Mario Galaxy and its varied delights.

I'm not talking about foundational games that defined a genre here, the way that every FPS game reminds old people like me of Doom, or how Metroidvanias always raise the specter of Symphony of the Night, but rather high watermarks in some genre or subgenre that haven't been surpassed yet. I also think that for a game to be a benchmark it needs to have some age on it. Sure, every 2D platformer will be compared to Super Mario Wonder for now, but that game is new and was fantastic so there's a lot of recency bias there. I think probably 5 or 10 years have to pass to give other games the chance to learn the lessons of the benchmark but fail to meet them.

What are some of your benchmark games in various genres or aspects of implementation?

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ZombiePie

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So, the point of contention I have is that it sounds like there's a possible difference of opinion if a "benchmark" should mark an average or median in a genre or if a benchmark should represent a "gold standard" for that genre. For me, as an educator, when I see the word "benchmark" I immediately think of the middle of a bell curve and with games that would be something that covers all of the bases and is a functional workman-like product.

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bigsocrates

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@zombiepie: My understanding is that the word can be used both ways. What it really means is a standard against which other things can be measured. So that can be an "average" standard that you compare things to, or it can be the best or one of the best of that kind, which the other, lesser, things can be compared to in order to judge their quality.

Cambridge Dictionary seems to suggest that my usage is permissible, because their example is:

Her outstanding performances set a new benchmark for singers throughout the world.

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#4  Edited By wollywoo

I can't seem to play any 3D platformer without wishing it was Mario. Specifically in terms of controls. Parkouring my way through levels while barely stopping to touch the ground feels amazing. I can't think of any other 3D platformer that comes close. I just got a PS5 and have been playing some of Astro's Playroom, and it's fun, but I think I recall Jeff saying that it's better than Mario, and that seems crazy to me.

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bigsocrates

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@wollywoo: I am a huge fan of Astro and I platinumed it soon after getting my PS5...but depending on which Mario you're comparing it to...

I guess it came out before Bowser's Fury (which is arguably the most directly comparable game because of their lengths) but if you want to put it up against Mario Galaxy (which also has some of the unique mechanics and moments that make Astro so good) it won't stand a chance.

It's not just the controls in Mario it's the incredible level design that always makes those games stand above their competition.

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I have one and it's a fairly obvious. I compare all soccer games to PES. FIFA's ... fine but it doesn't do the PES things so I only take a slight dabble in it. Even when it comes to things distinctly FIFA like the Ultimate Team stuff, I only get into that nightmare when it's part of a PES/eFootball (eurgh) package.

The 3D Platformer debate is a little different. Sure, Mario 64 laid the marker but I couldn't imagine Lara Croft wahooing all over the place. And yes, I am considering Tomb Raider a 3D platformer. 'cos it is.

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"Benchmark" does make me just want to say Crysis or Flight Simulator but that's boring.

The Brutal Doom mod for GZDoom gives me a sense of absolute visceral mayhem i have not experienced in any shooter since, the constant gratifying feedback of simply shooting things never gets old.

"Goldeneye" never became a genre really, i did try TimeSplitters but fell off of it, and while i love the post cold war atmosphere of Goldeneye and the simplicity of its levels which makes it fun to try higher difficulties, i think Perfect Dark is the best game in that "genre". Additional objectives is a core part of it, and the increased variety of the levels, gadgets and guns over Goldeneye helps complete the experience.

Flight Simulator, i included it anyway, not because maxing out the graphics on a high end rig delivers amazing visuals but because it realises the idea of playing Google Earth the video game, recreating the planet in that level of detail is game changing in the flight sim genre, and not something anyone else can match without richest company in the world levels of server bandwidth.

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tp0p

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#9  Edited By tp0p

By genre standards:

Arpg: diablo 3

Kart racer: crash team racing remaster or mario kart 8

Racing game: forza horizon 5

Open world action rpg: elden ring

Open world sandbox rpg: skyrim/fallout/starfield - bethesda

Open world sandbox: gta 5 or breath of the wild

Arcade sports game: tony hawk

1st person shooter: halo 2/odst or quake/doom

3rd person shooter: gears of war series

2d Platformer: donkey kong tropical freeze

3d platformer: super mario odyssey?

Action game: bayonetta 2

Arcade racer: burnout series or outrun/ridge racer

Can't think of any other genres at the moment

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#10 alianger  Online

I made a huge list and realized how out of touch I am with some genres and maybe gaming as a whole. Oh well, here are some of them:

RTS Gold: StarCraft II w/ Expansions (PC, 2010/2013/2015)

Benchmark/worthwhile game minimum: C&C: Red Alert, Warcraft II, Dungeon Keeper (PC, 1997)(KeeperFX), Populous: The Beginning (PC)

-

WRPG (open-ended RPG): Baldur's Gate II and Fallout 2, Ultima Underworld or System Shock 1 for map systems only

Benchmark/worthwhile game minimum: Ultima VII (worldbuilding, dialogue), Daggerfall Unity when it comes to movement, Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines (PC, 2004)(10.9 fan patch​), Fallout 3 (tricky to rank because it's such a mixed bag)

-

Platform Adventure/Metroidvania: Monster Boy and the Cursed Kingdom (PC, 2018), Super Metroid, Ori 2, Metroid Fusion; Aquaria, Ultima Underworld or System Shock 1 for map systems, Castlevania: Circle of the Moon (GBA, 2001)(w/ mods) for its difficulty scaling and rewarding exploration

Benchmark/worthwhile game minimum: Wonder Boy III: The Dragon's Trap/Monster World II, Symphony of the Night, Guacamalee, Flashback (AMI, 1992/PC/MD, 1993/MCD, 1994), Exhumed/Powerslave (PC, 1996)(3D),

-

Platformer: SMB3, Super Mario All-Stars (SNES, 1993), Yoshi's Island, Sonic Mania (PC, 2017), Shinobi III: Return of the Ninja Master (MD, 1993), Rocket Knight Adventures (MD, 1993), Mega Man X2, / Super Mario Galaxy (Wii, 2007)

Benchmark/worthwhile game minimum: DKC Returns, Freedom Planet (PC, 2014), Castlevania: Bloodlines, Rokko Chan (PC, 2011)​ & MM3 / Prince of Persia: Sands of Time (PS2/PC), Star Wars Jedi Knight: Dark Forces II (PC, 1997)(FP), Spyro 2 (PS1),

-

Puzzle: Portal (PC, 2007), Braid (PC, 2008), Donkey Kong (GB, 1994), Mole Mania (GB, 1996), Puyo Puyo 2 or Super Puyo Puyo 2 Remix (MD, 1994/SNES, 1995)

​​​Worthwhile: The Incredible Machine (PC), Oddworld: Abe's Oddysee (PS1/PC), Lemmings (PC, 1991), World of Goo (PC, 2008), Solomon's Key (NES/ARC, 1986)

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Action Adventure/ARPG: The Legend of Zelda: Link's Awakening (GB, 1993) & The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past (SNES, 1991), Terranigma (SNES, 1995), / Batman: Arkham Asylum (PC, 2009), Darksiders II: DE (PC, 2012/2015),

​​Benchmark/worthwhile game minimum: Ys: The Oath in Felghana (PC, 2005/2012), Strife (PC, 1996)(Veteran Edition), Diablo (PC, 1996), OSylvan Tale (GG, 1995), Beyond Good & Evil (2003)

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SRPG: Heroes of Might and Magic III (PC, 1999), X-COM, Langrisser II (MD, 1994), Shining Force II (MD, 1993)

Worthwhile: Vixen 357 (MD, 1992), King's Bounty (1990/MD, 1991)

-

Beat 'em up: Streets of Rage 4 (PC, 2020)(v1.08), Alien vs. Predator (ARC, 1994)

Worthwhile: TMNT III: The Manhattan Project/TMNT III (NES, 1991), TMNT: The Hyperstone Heist (MD), Fight'n Rage (PC, 2017), Dungeon Magic/Light Bringer (ARC, 1994) / Devil May Cry,

-

Shoot 'em up: Thunder Force IV, G-Darius and Darius Gaiden, Seirei Senshi Spriggan (Spirit Warrior Spriggan)(PCE CD, 1991), Jamestown (PC, 2011), Star Fox 64 (N64, 1997), Power Strike II (SMS, 1993), Fantasy Zone II DX (ARC, 2008/3DS, 2014)

​Worthwhile: Tyrian 2000 (PC, 1999), UN Squadron/Area 88 (SNES, 1991), Sin & Punishment (N64, 2000), Panzer Dragoon (SAT)

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#11  Edited By AV_Gamer

When it comes to fighting games, it at least must have the basics Street Fighter 2 made popular, before adding any other gameplay mechanics. This includes 3D fighting games. One could say Tekken is the benchmark, but even Tekken goes by the SFII template. Some might even claim Virtual Fighter should be the benchmark for 3D fighting games, especially VF2, but as much as I love the VF series, I do believe Tekken has long surpassed it.

When it comes to First-Person Shooters, I still believe Doom is the standard for the fast, twitchy gameplay games, and Half-Life is the benchmark for the narrative focused gameplay.

RPGs from the East, I say Final Fantasy, even though most will claim Dragon Quest. Which is understandable, because FF was mostly based on DQ, but I think FF has long surpassed them. At least before they started getting other ideas. Western RPGs, I guess, would be Elder Scrolls, but I'm not too sure about that.

Racing games is Outrun and Ridge Racer for the benchmarks.

I could go on and on.

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I haven’t played the remake of Mafia 1 yet but the original Mafia and GTA3 were def benchmark games for open world games.

I don’t have unique picks.

MGS2 and FFX are my benchmarks for AAA games and for their respective genres. Pokémon is a benchmark for how obsessed I got for a franchise.

Tony Hawk, Max Payne, StarCraft are my measuring stick for western games. (I’m an immigrant and didn’t play a ton of non-japanese games for a long time.)

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@liquiddragon: I thought about saying MGS2 as it's so incredible but i don't know what specific things it exceeds in, for example i think Splinter Cell is a better stealth game, and while for PS2 the in-game cinematics are amazing i'd put MGS4's above them on a technical level.

I'd happily give MGS2 10/10 i'm a super fan, but the overall package is better than the sum of its parts.

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@cikame: In my mind, I have to take into account time and place of when a game was released. MGS2 was absolutely mindblowing on so many levels in 2001. I didn't find MGS4 nearly as impressive in 2008 considering its peers at the time. Personally, I rank it low as a mainline MGS game as well. Can't speak for Splinter Cell. I thought it seemed really cool at the time and did enjoy the demo of the first game a bunch. I've only played thru Conviction and thought it was kinda meh. That said, I've bought pretty much all of 'em and do intend to at least play Chaos Theory and Blacklist soon.