I am a shit Diablo III player, and i am ok with that, i think the game is fun.

on my way to a boss this particular night i maybe earned lets say 10k gold. failing at the boss cost me around 60k.

this means i need to stop my active progression playing, the fun part, and spend time farming. not so much fun especially when its forced on you.

now am i saying Blizzard needs to make the game easier so everyone can progress on inferno?

nope, I'm saying if i come to a boss and i can't kill him, its all on me. BUT don't make me spend hours doing un fun stuff like grinding in order to keep trying.

can I use the real money auction house to buy gold and prevent grinding? probably. but that essentially turns Diablo into an MMO like subscription, not what i was wanting.

comic guy voice *worst patch change ever*

/rant

Well uh, shit bro.

So, you're playing Diablo and don't want to grind previous parts to get gold for repairs. Sounds like the wrong attitude for the game. It's essentially how you even get to Inferno....

They're too high, especially for solo people who die on bosses (aren't you supposed to die and learn and try again with boss fights?) or who are progressing.
I support the costs being upped but they might have been upped a little too much.
 
Not everyone spend their first days on Diablo exploiting or shit to make millions so they can now sink it away.

@ck1nd said:

So, you're playing Diablo and don't want to grind previous parts to get gold for repairs. Sounds like the wrong attitude for the game. It's essentially how you even get to Inferno....

Maybe I am misunderstanding what you are saying but you never had to grind gold to repair before.

They over did it when they made attacking anything take a hit out of your durability.

It costs me about 50g to break a pot.

So essentially:

• You attack = durability loss.
• You get hit = durability loss.
• You die = durability loss.

Now add the IAS nerf: you're now taking longer to kill things and increasing the chances of getting hit/dying, losing even more.

It's a great cycle.

Whether it was supposed to help balance the in-game economy, auction house prices et al, it has made the game a drag. Who wants to go back and farm Hell to build up the funds to deal with the now higher damage costs? Not me. And where is the great gear and gems, Inferno. Just a crappy decision imo.

To be fair, is it just me or did they already lower the costs today? I don't have any ignore damage gear, and I was paying almost 10,000 gold less(still too much but heh)for a full repair this morning.

They're too high, especially for solo people who die on bosses (aren't you supposed to die and learn and try again with boss fights?) or who are progressing. I support the costs being upped but they might have been upped a little too much.  Not everyone spend their first days on Diablo exploiting or shit to make millions so they can now sink it away.

Everytime I see Bashiok and the hordes of Blizzard supporters saying that you need to play better and death is avoidable I have to wonder if they're playing a different game...

This isn't fucking Dark Souls where the combat and defense is all on you. There is so much unavoidable damage it's obscene. Repair bills don't make me want "play better" they make me want to "shut this fucking game off"

@ck1nd said:

So, you're playing Diablo and don't want to grind previous parts to get gold for repairs. Sounds like the wrong attitude for the game. It's essentially how you even get to Inferno....

Right. People should grind away for around two hours in order to try for fifteen minutes of progression. That's not fun in the least bit. It's punishment for what exploiters have done in the game, which is bullshit.

The way you solve it is with higher resurrection timers. It may be irritating for everyone, but it's not costing them a massive amount of gold, and it kills the quick farm times for graveyard zergers.

This is crazy. My evening playthough used to be grinding to get around 70k gold so I could buy new gear, and that was with at least 4 repairs. Now I expect I'll be retreating a whole lot more than before.

I find myself playing less and less each day. Not really because of a patch change, I just this this doesn't have near the longevity Diablo 2 did, makes me sad :(

@Xeirus: I'm in the same boat. It's not grabbing me like Diablo 2 did. Not sure how to quantify, though.

@Zomgfruitbunnies: I made it to Inferno and then my interest just took a -huge- dive. I didn't find act 1 inferno all that hard, I just... I dunno, just lost interest.

Hopefully that PVP update gives it some legs again, it's just boring now.

I haven't had the repair costs hurt me too much as I haven't played in the past few days, but it def needed to be raised, but I feel like Blizz is making such huge changes without even thinking.

They dropped the gem upgrade cost like 20k then up the repair cost by the same if not more, it's crazy.

@Garfield518: don't forget to add in the enrage timers. If you take too long to kill a boss or mob they get enraged and become difficult... then the vicious circle continues lol. I have to agree with the OP. The repair costs are way to high and like someone said before this isn't Dark Souls. I hope this is an issue that they are looking into and maybe contemplating fixing.

@stinky: If your dieing you need more resistance. By the time you hit act 2 you really should have +50 on all your armor items. Barring rings and amulets, but those too if you can. Try it, you wont have anything to cry about I promise.

yeah, that was my feeling. Blizzard has my $60, why make me grind for more play time? why keep up the MMO methodology.

@jakob187 said:

Right. People should grind away for around two hours in order to try for fifteen minutes of progression. That's not fun in the least bit. It's punishment for what exploiters have done in the game, which is bullshit.

@Xeirus: I stopped playing regularly after completing Nightmare. I was bored. Never felt the excitement of jumping into a higher difficulty with Diablo 3. Maybe I've outgrown the genre. I don't know.

@John1912: +50 what? resistance to physical?

@stinky said:

@John1912: +50 what? resistance to physical?

+50 all resist

I got over +50 all resist on my DH and the cheap deaths on inferno are still happening. Good AR gear that is balanced is expensive too. Maybe for a melee character that'd be more effective, and maybe more like +200-300 AR to survive some of these rediculous champ mobs. And heh, I really don't mind the challenge that much if there's hope of finding better gear or saving enough to get something difference making in the AH, but the gold drain is just abusive right now. And again, it's from all contact in the gameworld, not just dying that causes the gear to wear and cost.

I'm done for a while at least. Too many other games in my backlog to deal with this any further.

I don't know why all these people are saying they have to grind Hell to make money. If your gear is so good that you're paying that much gold for repairs, clearing Act I Inferno should be easy as pie for you right?

@cyraxible said:

Everytime I see Bashiok and the hordes of Blizzard supporters saying that you need to play better and death is avoidable I have to wonder if they're playing a different game...

This isn't fucking Dark Souls where the combat and defense is all on you. There is so much unavoidable damage it's obscene. Repair bills don't make me want "play better" they make me want to "shut this fucking game off"

It isn't like dark souls where you need to be skilled. But you do need to know about the game and gear to not die. I've played through nightmare so far on hardcore and not came close to dying yet just because I'm playing slower paced.

I can't remember how my softcore progression was at, but I could do act 1 inferno runs without ever dying either.

@Zomgfruitbunnies said:

@Xeirus: I stopped playing regularly after completing Nightmare. I was bored. Never felt the excitement of jumping into a higher difficulty with Diablo 3. Maybe I've outgrown the genre. I don't know.

It doesn't kick in until Act 3 in Hell. The entire game is a complete joke in terms of difficulty before then, but once you fight elites with 3+ combos, in act 3+, it's actually pretty challenging and fun.

Back to the topic, yes, this change is retarded. Increasing repair costs? Fine, okay, yeah, zerging was lame, this is one fix I guess (why not simply full heal them? whatever.)

But they went way too far. Like, way too far. It costs me a fortune even if I do not die because items degrade so fast in this game.

So they either need to make items not degrade, or at least not as quickly, or cut the costs in half.

Because at this point, farming will actually cost you money in some circumstances, especially with all the gold nerfs they introduced. They're really trying to push that RMAH

What they fixed is that you can now play on inferno with 3 other players and not constantly die. Once you kill enough champions to get 5 nephalem valor, every champion group drops one rare garanteed. So you will be making a lot more money than you are losing and its more fun to play in a group than grinding it out solo. So the patch was a good thing, stop whining.

Repair costs are totally fine i'm playing with friends and they always make me angry how casually they play and stand around idling and don't use their full skills or try to avoid dying because they don't really care about death. NOW THEY DO, they join up and play focused and controlled, this is the a great change, I might even consider playing public games now since people won't be such idiots all the time. Its like a filtering mechanism. I finally feel rewarded for playing cautiously... before the people who were just running in and zerging elites were making more money than me... Now I am... glad methodical play is finally rewarded.

Does anyone know what happens if you run completely out of gold, have a 20k repair bill, and nothing in the bank to sell and no other way to fund repairs?

@MB said:

Does anyone know what happens if you run completely out of gold, have a 20k repair bill, and nothing in the bank to sell and no other way to fund repairs?

Well, they do tell you when you die if you're low on gold and in the yellow, so that's a scenario that should not happen. But even with all busted gear you can go back difficulties and kill things easily for vendor trash.

Repairing was to cheap before thats a fact..... i think blizzard finally did something right.

@stinky said:

I am a shit Diablo III player, and i am ok with that, i think the game is fun.

on my way to a boss this particular night i maybe earned lets say 10k gold. failing at the boss cost me around 60k.

this means i need to stop my active progression playing, the fun part, and spend time farming. not so much fun especially when its forced on you.

now am i saying Blizzard needs to make the game easier so everyone can progress on inferno?

nope, I'm saying if i come to a boss and i can't kill him, its all on me. BUT don't make me spend hours doing un fun stuff like grinding in order to keep trying.

can I use the real money auction house to buy gold and prevent grinding? probably. but that essentially turns Diablo into an MMO like subscription, not what i was wanting.

comic guy voice *worst patch change ever*

/rant

Dude, the game's over already for you. The whole point from here on out is to spending time making the numbers go up on your equipment by putting in either hundreds of hours, or some real money into Blizzard's RMAH (Why do you think they increased the repair costs? They don't want to you to just finish Inferno). If the loot treadmill isn't fun, it's probably best to just get off.

@MB said:

Does anyone know what happens if you run completely out of gold, have a 20k repair bill, and nothing in the bank to sell and no other way to fund repairs?

You have to make a new character, earn 20k of gold, then you can go back to the old character, repair, and take them back to an earlier act or back to Hell difficulty to rebuild some savings.

The repair cost change is good. Repeatedly dying your way through content so you can get incredibly far ahead and farm the best gear creates class imbalance and fucks up the economy. Larger repair costs also remove gold from the economy and helps fight inflation, which is already starting to get out of hand.

Level 60 Witch Doctor 
Act II. Inferno 
 
When 1.0.3 dropped I was pretty baffled to say the least. But, as time goes by, I'm finding my class and evolving builds more fun!

Pre 1.0.3  
- I was endlessly stacking IAS (increased attack speed) for Spinters neglecting any defence for pure DPS.
-  If over-powered by an  elite/rare or boss I'd continue to smash my (Poison Dart) head against it until I brute forced my way through. 
- Nefarious players were making insane  amounts of gold. 
- More time was spent kiting than killing

Post 1.0.3 
- I now spread my stats and skills out. Adding Vitality, Armour and Resists makes me feel more bad-ass than glass-ass!
- Realization that some mobs are intended to be beyond my 'current' build and I look at new and interesting ways of overcoming the  situation.  
-  Nerfarious players are making less-insane amounts of gold.
- I'm doing a lot less kiting and a ton more killing! 
 
Current Build: Toxic Avenger!

I understand a lot of people are disappointed that the game now requires farming before you can progress. Sadly for you, this is how the game was intended to be played. If you were brute forcing you way through Inferno and dying a lot, then you were not playing the game the way it was designed to be played.

I also see that a lot of fun can be had by playing a game differently to the will of the designers, but when you buy a game by Blizzard you HAVE to know that they're going to do their best to balance things by patching constantly.

By balancing the game a little more to how they intended it to be, they've balanced the fun, bringing some people's enjoyment down a little. That's a shame, but personally I think balancing things will make the game better in the long run.

I have little sympathy for all the people that think they should be able to get through Inferno by dying a lot. Diablo is not a linear game, this isn't a shooter where you respawn and try again. If you don't want to farm any more, or at all, then stop playing Diablo. You picked up the wrong game.

@Smersh: Awesome. What sort of gear do you need for that build? Life on hit? Currently I'm still on Act 1, farming with 30k DPS splinters crit gear.

I don't have a problem with repair cost that are dished out every time I die, but even without dying I'm seeing a good chunk of gold going into repair. I've also heard that durability is also lost due to breaking any of the in-game items like pots and barrels. I'm not really complaining as much as I'd like blizz to at least remove or reduce repairs for everything that doesn't include dying. I don't need a total repair bill of 30K every time my monk needs to farm Nightmare in order to obtain crafting supplies and better gear for my alts.

@Spiritgod said:

I don't have a problem with repair cost that are dished out every time I die, but even without dying I'm seeing a good chunk of gold going into repair. I've also heard that durability is also lost due to breaking any of the in-game items like pots and barrels. I'm not really complaining as much as I'd like blizz to at least remove or reduce repairs for everything that doesn't include dying. I don't need a total repair bill of 30K every time my monk needs to farm Nightmare in order to obtain crafting supplies and better gear for my alts.

I believe the point is that it's a gold sink.

If you weren't spending a lot of your gold on repairs then inflation of gold would really pick up. Personally I think the game should have launched like this. No one would've been upset if repair costs had always been this way. Blizzard released a pretty unfinished end-game.

@Panpipe said:

@Spiritgod said:

I don't have a problem with repair cost that are dished out every time I die, but even without dying I'm seeing a good chunk of gold going into repair. I've also heard that durability is also lost due to breaking any of the in-game items like pots and barrels. I'm not really complaining as much as I'd like blizz to at least remove or reduce repairs for everything that doesn't include dying. I don't need a total repair bill of 30K every time my monk needs to farm Nightmare in order to obtain crafting supplies and better gear for my alts.

I believe the point is that it's a gold sink.

If you weren't spending a lot of your gold on repairs then inflation of gold would really pick up. Personally I think the game should have launched like this. No one would've been upset if repair costs had always been this way. Blizzard released a pretty unfinished end-game.

This may have been a means to deal with the in-game economy but I really think it went too far. Like I said, if you want to punish players for dying then fine, I don't have a problem with that, it lets the player know that maybe the area they're in isn't for them, but having everything you do in-game cost a small amount of gold is a little stupid. Thankfully the developers are looking into fixing this issue.

@pweidman said:

I got over +50 all resist on my DH and the cheap deaths on inferno are still happening. Good AR gear that is balanced is expensive too. Maybe for a melee character that'd be more effective, and maybe more like +200-300 AR to survive some of these rediculous champ mobs. And heh, I really don't mind the challenge that much if there's hope of finding better gear or saving enough to get something difference making in the AH, but the gold drain is just abusive right now. And again, it's from all contact in the gameworld, not just dying that causes the gear to wear and cost.

I'm done for a while at least. Too many other games in my backlog to deal with this any further.

Ur kidding right? u think 50 resis all is good? thats one item with resist all. I have 1100 resist all on my barb.

@kelbear said:

@stinky said:

I am a shit Diablo III player, and i am ok with that, i think the game is fun.

on my way to a boss this particular night i maybe earned lets say 10k gold. failing at the boss cost me around 60k.

this means i need to stop my active progression playing, the fun part, and spend time farming. not so much fun especially when its forced on you.

now am i saying Blizzard needs to make the game easier so everyone can progress on inferno?

nope, I'm saying if i come to a boss and i can't kill him, its all on me. BUT don't make me spend hours doing un fun stuff like grinding in order to keep trying.

can I use the real money auction house to buy gold and prevent grinding? probably. but that essentially turns Diablo into an MMO like subscription, not what i was wanting.

comic guy voice *worst patch change ever*

/rant

Dude, the game's over already for you. The whole point from here on out is to spending time making the numbers go up on your equipment by putting in either hundreds of hours, or some real money into Blizzard's RMAH (Why do you think they increased the repair costs? They don't want to you to just finish Inferno). If the loot treadmill isn't fun, it's probably best to just get off.

So blizzard makes you have less disposable gold so they get less money on the AH all so they can make money off the AH? Got it!

@Smersh said:

Level 60 Witch Doctor
Act II. Inferno

When 1.0.3 dropped I was pretty baffled to say the least. But, as time goes by, I'm finding my class and evolving builds more fun!

Pre 1.0.3
- I was endlessly stacking IAS (increased attack speed) for Spinters neglecting any defence for pure DPS.
- If over-powered by an elite/rare or boss I'd continue to smash my (Poison Dart) head against it until I brute forced my way through.
- Nefarious players were making insane amounts of gold.
- More time was spent kiting than killing

Post 1.0.3
- I now spread my stats and skills out. Adding Vitality, Armour and Resists makes me feel more bad-ass than glass-ass!
- Realization that some mobs are intended to be beyond my 'current' build and I look at new and interesting ways of overcoming the situation.
- Nerfarious players are making less-insane amounts of gold.
- I'm doing a lot less kiting and a ton more killing!

Current Build: Toxic Avenger!

This is what it's about! I share the sentiment, I finally have a balanced build that doesn't feel cheap

@stinky: All Resistance

To gear up for Inferno, you basically need to be looking for pieces of armour with your main damage stat, vitality, and All Resistance. Then things like crit, attack speed, and life on hit depending on your class and build.

Having gone through the 1-60 grind pre and post 1.03, I really don't think the repair costs are out of control. If you can't make 100k an hour on Act3/4 Nightmare then you're either not picking it up or you're salvaging too many blues. Sell everything under ilvl61 and break all the pots, you'll have tons of gold.

@Panpipe said:

I understand a lot of people are disappointed that the game now requires farming before you can progress. Sadly for you, this is how the game was intended to be played. If you were brute forcing you way through Inferno and dying a lot, then you were not playing the game the way it was designed to be played.

I also see that a lot of fun can be had by playing a game differently to the will of the designers, but when you buy a game by Blizzard you HAVE to know that they're going to do their best to balance things by patching constantly.

By balancing the game a little more to how they intended it to be, they've balanced the fun, bringing some people's enjoyment down a little. That's a shame, but personally I think balancing things will make the game better in the long run.

I have little sympathy for all the people that think they should be able to get through Inferno by dying a lot. Diablo is not a linear game, this isn't a shooter where you respawn and try again. If you don't want to farm any more, or at all, then stop playing Diablo. You picked up the wrong game.

@Smersh: Awesome. What sort of gear do you need for that build? Life on hit? Currently I'm still on Act 1, farming with 30k DPS splinters crit gear.

You're a complete retard if you think farming for gold is a smart design decision. They said themselves that the repair increase was to combat people zerging fights. If you're solo and die, the mob regains all its HP back. If you're in a group...I'm not sure what happens, but it would have been more effective to have the mob gain a percentage of health back for each player killed, or a stacking enrage effect, something other than "we really want you to rage when you die".

The game needs a gold sink for sure, with inflation and all. But tying it in with the penalty for death is not the right way to go; increase the cut on the AH, nerf gold drops or something. The point is, they had 2 separate problems and used a single, absolute shit solution to fix them both simultaneously.

For the IAS crowd, you should realize that you're going to get hit, assuming the whole "I use IAS so I can kite easier" reasoning is true. You should've been stacking armor and resists anyway.

I like Diablo 3 but there is a bunch of fucking bullshit going on in there game design-wise, and this new hike in repair costs is one of them. Let's review:

There are rare monsters with random properties, 4 of them on inferno. You're a barbarian facing a pack of fast/horde/desecrator/molten? Tough fucking luck. There's just no way to beat some packs without graveyard zerging them. So unless you avoid them, there will be deaths involved. It's just inevitable. So to counter this 'abuse', which really is just a natural player reaction to some unbalanced design, favored against the player, they chose to make repairs ridiculously expensive. Wut? That's not fixing the actual problem. If you're playing solo especially, there are just bound to be rare/champions with properties you cannot deal with. That's the problem that should be addressed.

@Oni said:

I like Diablo 3 but there is a bunch of fucking bullshit going on in there game design-wise, and this new hike in repair costs is one of them. Let's review:

There are rare monsters with random properties, 4 of them on inferno. You're a barbarian facing a pack of fast/horde/desecrator/molten? Tough fucking luck. There's just no way to beat some packs without graveyard zerging them. So unless you avoid them, there will be deaths involved. It's just inevitable. So to counter this 'abuse', which really is just a natural player reaction to some unbalanced design, favored against the player, they chose to make repairs ridiculously expensive. Wut? That's not fixing the actual problem. If you're playing solo especially, there are just bound to be rare/champions with properties you cannot deal with. That's the problem that should be addressed.

? Wt? You can deal with anything... if you can't deal with act 2 farm act 1 instead. That simple... I havent died on my barb in bout 2 weeks... zerging is't a solution... its just noob behavior.

@gamefreak9 said:

@Oni said:

I like Diablo 3 but there is a bunch of fucking bullshit going on in there game design-wise, and this new hike in repair costs is one of them. Let's review:

There are rare monsters with random properties, 4 of them on inferno. You're a barbarian facing a pack of fast/horde/desecrator/molten? Tough fucking luck. There's just no way to beat some packs without graveyard zerging them. So unless you avoid them, there will be deaths involved. It's just inevitable. So to counter this 'abuse', which really is just a natural player reaction to some unbalanced design, favored against the player, they chose to make repairs ridiculously expensive. Wut? That's not fixing the actual problem. If you're playing solo especially, there are just bound to be rare/champions with properties you cannot deal with. That's the problem that should be addressed.

? Wt? You can deal with anything... if you can't deal with act 2 farm act 1 instead. That simple... I havent died on my barb in bout 2 weeks... zerging is't a solution... its just noob behavior.

Yeah, if you can't handle an act that should be possible via levels and skill (GY zerg aside), go farm a lower level act you already completed in order to get gold for repairs/buy shit from the AH. Excellent design philosophy right there.

If Blizzard's vision of Inferno was a small minority of people who enjoy Act farming trivial content until they are allowed to progress to the next act and do it again (something going against the entire rest of the game), good fucking job, they nailed it.

@cyraxible said:

Everytime I see Bashiok and the hordes of Blizzard supporters saying that you need to play better and death is avoidable I have to wonder if they're playing a different game...

This isn't fucking Dark Souls where the combat and defense is all on you. There is so much unavoidable damage it's obscene. Repair bills don't make me want "play better" they make me want to "shut this fucking game off"

Also this, I forgot to support it in my last post. They seem to think this is wow where you indeed get out of the fire. Waller/Mortar/Vortex/Jailer says hi. I don't mean to undermine people who have successfully beaten Inferno, but I'm sure it's much less about skill, and more about luck with affixes, class decision (wondering how many WDs have beaten it), and farming gold/gear instead of actually playing without bumps in the road.

@Ulain said:

@gamefreak9 said:

@Oni said:

I like Diablo 3 but there is a bunch of fucking bullshit going on in there game design-wise, and this new hike in repair costs is one of them. Let's review:

There are rare monsters with random properties, 4 of them on inferno. You're a barbarian facing a pack of fast/horde/desecrator/molten? Tough fucking luck. There's just no way to beat some packs without graveyard zerging them. So unless you avoid them, there will be deaths involved. It's just inevitable. So to counter this 'abuse', which really is just a natural player reaction to some unbalanced design, favored against the player, they chose to make repairs ridiculously expensive. Wut? That's not fixing the actual problem. If you're playing solo especially, there are just bound to be rare/champions with properties you cannot deal with. That's the problem that should be addressed.

? Wt? You can deal with anything... if you can't deal with act 2 farm act 1 instead. That simple... I havent died on my barb in bout 2 weeks... zerging is't a solution... its just noob behavior.

Yeah, if you can't handle an act that should be possible via levels and skill (GY zerg aside), go farm a lower level act you already completed in order to get gold for repairs/buy shit from the AH. Excellent design philosophy right there.

If Blizzard's vision of Inferno was a small minority of people who enjoy Act farming trivial content until they are allowed to progress to the next act and do it again (something going against the entire rest of the game), good fucking job, they nailed it.

so... your expecting to be able to push through the hardest difficulty is one go?? Of course you have to prepare... I'd even say its too easy to gear up... I've spent less than 1 million on the AH and I can almost get thru act 3. They just want you to keep doing acts you can actually do and not think there's no penalty for keep zerging. You could also just make mobs instantly heal when they kill someone, but that doesn't reward skillful gameplay as much, besides more repair costs means deflated AH prices.

Blizzard's vision was a challenging act which only a minority of players would be able to get thru... SO YES! If you don't got the patience or the skill then go back to hell mode. Inferno is intended to be the challenge, not some breeze for everyone to get through.

On the one hand, I agree with you in principle that repair costs are too high, however, I make Inferno progress in public games and I think most people play inferno in groups, which really goes much better. Give it a shot, it's fun. IRT everyone saying the game on the highest difficulty isn't for them, I'm not sure I understand your disappointment. If you made it through Nightmare, that's a solid $60 of content right there, not counting any alternate characters you made. I agree that it lost some of its allure in the highest difficulty (for me, it's because the likelihood of finding upgrades among drops becomes so low) but I don't feel any regret that such is the case. I've gotten my money's worth regardless of how much more I play.

To be fair, the concept of what is or is not $60 worth of a game is entirely subjective.